Few names carry the weight and legacy of Mark Kerr, the two-time NCAA wrestling champion and ADCC absolute champion known as “The Smashing Machine.” During a recent appearance on the Jaxxon Podcast with Rampage Jackson, Kerr opened up about a pivotal moment in his jiu-jitsu journey that ultimately shaped his philosophy.
Kerr, whose wrestling dominance was legendary, recounted his sole attempt at training in the gi with Brazilian jiu-jitsu master Rigan Machado – an experience that left him vowing never to don the traditional uniform again.
“I’ve done gi with Rigan Machado one time. That was it. And that was one time only,” Kerr explained. “It was like he had an extra set of hands. We were at a studio in Torrance, so he had a wall on one side and the other side. The door was open where I go, ‘Oh yeah, I’ll go gi with you.’ And so we go gi, and I’m just getting frustrated. I’m getting really frustrated.”
The wrestling phenom found himself in unfamiliar territory, unable to apply his normally dominant control against Machado‘s technical gi game. What made the experience particularly jarring was the audience of onlookers witnessing his struggle.
“Everyone’s kind of poking their head around the door, looking in,” Kerr recalled. “I don’t even remember how long we went, but it was like one of those things where I’m never doing this again. Like never doing this again. I’m getting up and going, ‘We’re going no-gi, bro.'”
The podcast took an even more fascinating turn when Leo Vieira himself joined the conversation. Vieira and Kerr faced off in one of ADCC’s most memorable matches in 2000, where the massive size difference between them (Kerr at around 240 pounds versus Vieira at approximately 165 pounds) created an iconic moment in submission grappling history.
“I came with one strategy and I changed in the mirror. The strategy was okay, I’ll pull guard. I’m going to save five minutes and then I’m going to let him get tired. Then I’m going to do some magic.”
However, Vieira quickly discovered the overwhelming power of Kerr‘s wrestling-honed grip strength.
“I never felt like a very strong grip like that. After this, I went in the shower and my wrist and my feet hurt so much from him squeezing.”
Kerr acknowledged that the nuances of gi jiu-jitsu were simply too foreign to his wrestling background.
“I could not figure out what he was doing because I just didn’t have those nuances. It’s the small little stuff.”
Vieira agreed, noting how the gi fundamentally changes grappling dynamics:
“You’re right. It’s like you have extra arms because people hold your lapel, which makes an extension of your body. So it’s like you feel stuck. You cannot move.”
For Kerr, the frustration came from losing the control that had defined his wrestling career.
“With no-gi, it’s like what I was doing in wrestling. I can control you. Not with the gi on.”
